Livi v St Johnstone

Lets keep this winning run going and help secure 7th place, hopefully Aberdeen will take something off Hibs and we open up a wee gap on them.

Would also be good if Dundee beat St Mirren to close the gap on St Johnstone to 2 pts, so the relegation battle is still going when Dundee play us in the last game, bursting for us to be the ones to officially relegate them at the Spaghettihad.

Would ensure a big support in our final home game too if Dundee were still in with a chance, giving us a big payday from their 7,000 fans, and 10,000 locked out on bubbles hill.

Anyway, would like to see Sibbald starting this game instead of Shinnie, and Forrest in a front three of Nouble-Forrest-Bailey.

Aye it's good being the kingmakers for a change.

St Johnstone have annoyed me this season. They are diving cheats so it would be pleasing to help to send them on their way to the championship. And as you say Liviforever we want that 7th spot.

orco wrote:Aye it's good being the kingmakers for a change.

St Johnstone have annoyed me this season. They are diving cheats so it would be pleasing to help to send them on their way to the championship. And as you say Liviforever we want that 7th spot.

They have been yep, i remember when they were relegated the last time we were in the top flight and they kicked us off the park, now they just go about screaming and diving, getting Nouble sent off was a shocking example of it, but a lot of the blame has to go to the refs too, encouraging such behaviour to go on.

Couldn't believe Murray Davidson getting a foul against Nouble either, throwing himself in front of him with his last ounce of strength, tripping Nouble up. He had used everything catching up with Nouble then just dived across him, he hadn't anything left to actually get in front of Nouble to be knocked over and buy the foul like Marv and Holt did/do, if anything it was a foul on Nouble tripping him up when he threw himself down at his feet. Then the infamous hand ball in the penalty box we didn't get, aye get these cheating feckers down too.

Think the word im looking for is retribution after we we're cheated up there last month.Perfect scenario,we scud them on Saturday and hopefully Big Jack and Arbroath send them down in the playoffs,though I'm discounting Caley to upst the applecart.Last of the Saturday 3ocloks and I intend to enjoy every minute of it before and after.Weve uncharacteristically got a bit of momentum having achieved our goal.Lets see if we can go unbeaten and indeed win the last 3 games.Its doable. Make it so Livi..

An absolutely no pressure game for us… but that makes them potentially dangerous opponents as they might be more “up for it” - on the other hand they are unlikely to catch St Midden now & just as unlikely to be caught by Dundee, so they just might try to save themselves for the play off final.

Either way let’s get in about them and give them the doing they deserve for being a thorn in our side last season and a couple of times this season.

Imperative we don't concede the first goal, we all know how difficult it is scoring against St Johnstone when they're defending a lead. They'd be pretty much 10 men behind the ball with all 10 outfield players inside their box anytime we get near to their goal.

I reckon we could get 2 or 3 if we score first though, forcing them into being more adventurous and hitting them on the counter attack. Also giving us a lot more room to get in behind them. Having no pressure also releases any tightness that playing with nerves gives you, and moves come off more.

Hope we really rattle a few past them, i'm going for 3-0 Livi, just have a feeling we'll do them.

Terrible game. Terrible referee, bought every dive they sold him.

Good cross by Brown and good movement by the lad that scored their goal but our defending was worse than schoolboy level. Though big Ivan could have claimed the cross before it reached the scorer but the defence did a reasonable impression of statues.

After their goal, big Ivan made some important saves to keep us in while Ayo did his best to gift wrap the points for them, he was a bombscare today, before & after the goal. His confidence seems to have been sapped since he started missing penalties as he has been the weakest link in the defence for weeks now.

Credit to the lads for not giving up though. In a sense a draw was about right as I didn’t think St J deserved their lead & we didn’t threaten them enough either. I thought we had blown the chance when Clark saved the initial header but thankfully Jack stayed composed to knock it in.

Despite poor defending for the goal, pass marks to Ivan, Nicky, Jack, Morgan, as they handled St J pretty well.

Holt had his poorest game for a very long time. Pittman was energetic but didn’t really make an impact on the game. Kelly was our best player again. Bailey does a lot of good things but disappears for spells, Shinnie makes contributions at both ends of the pitch but very few are telling contributions. Nouble worked his backside off for no reward & is both wrongly penalised and gets nothing when fouled, needed someone alongside to feed off him.

Forrest came on and had an impact for 5 mins then disappeared.
Chucky came on and did ok.
Soto came on.

Not sure what Martindale’s game plan was because we didn’t seem to have one… when Saints scored I began thinking that Callum Davidson has DM’s number. It was almost as if DM sent them out not to lose rather than to go for the win, which is disappointing, because St J are not that good… that said they always seem well organised when we play them, so not sure what they’ve been doing wrong all season.

Yeh agree Nick,not much to add too your summaries. Spot on.One man up front for 3 quarter's of the game summed it up for me.Havent looked at the table.But the objective was achieved weeks ago.A few players you won't see in a Livi top next season. I thank them.But We move on..

God awful first half, Ayo almost gifted them a goal in the first few minutes trying to hold off an opposition player and losing the ball, instead of clearing the danger. In fairness he knocked every ball clear or out of play after that, taking no chances, pity he didn't keep that going 2nd half but i'll get to that. Boyes got caught a few times trying to beat players and play it out of defence, and was reluctant to get up past the halfway line.
Nouble ran about with little or no back up trying to press their defenders, we were playing far too deep with no support from midfield, as they all stayed in our own half most of the time when we lost possession. It very much looked like we had settled for defending a 0-0 draw and couldn't be arsed pressing them, except for Nouble.

2nd half was better, and we at least started closing players down and backing one another up, forcing mistakes, should've been a goal up when Bailey got onto a long ball over the top by Obileye, then got hit with a sucker punch from nowhere when St Johnstone put in a good cross from Brown, as Bertie said our defenders were posted missing leaving 2 of their player free at the back post, something we've done a lot of this season. After that Obileye did his best to assist them with another couple of goals, with suicidal passes going to St Johnstone players, and Ivan coming to the rescue.

Over the piece a draw was about right, though i still think we'd have scudded them if we'd scored that Bailey chance, think it would've given us some hunger to go and score more, but wasn't to be, and i really didn't think St Johnstone deserved to win.

Chuk came on and looked decent though, so would like to see more of him in our final 2 games, may well be worth getting him back on loan at the start of next season, got himself involved more and didn't look anything like his earlier appearances. Also found out a lot more about Ivan from this game than the Hibs one, he looks a decent keeper.

Pitts was pressing first half but that left us short in midfield and Holt was off the boil.

Nobody except Nouble was pressing in the opposition half in the first half, Nouble was chasing around and all the rest of our players were standing back in our half. We were allowing them to play it around their back 3 and bring it out of their half far too much. Even when we got the ball we just hit it up the pitch and lost every 2nd ball because no one was looking to get up there and attack in numbers. There was a big difference in us pushing more 2nd half though, and we pressed them far more.

The biggest talking point of the game for me was the unbelievable amount of diving St Johnstone got away with. It was downright embarrassing at times with the screaming accompanying it every time. Collum was perfectly happy to go along with it too.

The game itself was horrible to watch. None of the swashbuckling attacking we've come to expect - just turgid passing back and sideways. The team looked like they had come not to lose rather than win. Ayo was dodgy, Nouble didn't really get going with his dribbling runs, Nicky chose the wrong passing option a couple of times in attack. The keeper definitely saved us, stopping the Hendry one on one but I'd still like to see him commanding his box better. I thought he could maybe have come out for the cross that led to the goal. I'm not convinced by Boyes. He puts the effort in but there's something missing in his game. I hope maybe this wee run in the team brings him on a bit but it's not there yet. Pitts and Holt put in a decent shift and Bailey shows class on the ball. We will miss him and Forrest next season.

Still we are where we are and a wee change in attitude for the next two should see us consolidate seventh place. Let's hope we finish with a flurry.

Liviforever wrote:Nobody except Nouble was pressing in the opposition half in the first half, Nouble was chasing around and all the rest of our players were standing back in our half. We were allowing them to play it around their back 3 and bring it out of their half far too much. Even when we got the ball we just hit it up the pitch and lost every 2nd ball because no one was looking to get up there and attack in numbers. There was a big difference in us pushing more 2nd half though, and we pressed them far more.

In the first half we were attacking the north stand, Pitts was regularly the closest of our players to the Saint’s goal. It wasn’t effective but he was doing it. Shinnie did it a couple of times too. Nouble did it the most. But they were all doing it in isolation so it was ineffective. When only one is pressing, it’s easy to play around it, so we didn’t have them under any sort of real pressure. The counter-press only works properly when you hunt in packs.

We didn’t put them under enough pressure in our attacks either. As Orco says it was all sideways & back. For the most part our buckle was okay (apart from conceding the goal & Ayo’s insistence on trying to self-destruct) but we had no swash whatsoever.

How lovely it is to have meaningless games (plural) at the end of a season. And here was me worrying over nothing

Auld Nick wrote:

Liviforever wrote:Nobody except Nouble was pressing in the opposition half in the first half, Nouble was chasing around and all the rest of our players were standing back in our half. We were allowing them to play it around their back 3 and bring it out of their half far too much. Even when we got the ball we just hit it up the pitch and lost every 2nd ball because no one was looking to get up there and attack in numbers. There was a big difference in us pushing more 2nd half though, and we pressed them far more.

In the first half we were attacking the north stand, Pitts was regularly the closest of our players to the Saint’s goal. It wasn’t effective but he was doing it. Shinnie did it a couple of times too. Nouble did it the most. But they were all doing it in isolation so it was ineffective. When only one is pressing, it’s easy to play around it, so we didn’t have them under any sort of real pressure. The counter-press only works properly when you hunt in packs.

We didn’t put them under enough pressure in our attacks either. As Orco says it was all sideways & back. For the most part our buckle was okay (apart from conceding the goal & Ayo’s insistence on trying to self-destruct) but we had no swash whatsoever.

Saw Shinnie doing it once, was like the time at Tanndice when Byrne was chasing down the ball going between 2 or 3 opposition players, but he didn't manage to catch them, and nobody would've been there anyway, backing him up. Can't remember Pitts doing it at all as the man furthest up the pitch, but Nouble was always having to chase lost causes with 3 CB's playing it around him. Main thing we can agree on is it was in isolation and frustrating to watch.

Yeah the sideways and back passing was annoying too, we had plenty chances to counter on them but slowed it right down and then went back the way, same with throw ins in their half, being thrown back into our half, then being put under pressure and passing it back to Ivan. Would like to see the stats for pass backs to the keeper, bet ours is higher than anyone esle.

Don't know what it is about St Johnstone/Davidson, but they/he always seems to get in Martindale's head, and our usual game plan/style of play, goes right out the window and we end up struggling against them. Seems to over think things and comes up with a weird strategy to play for a draw, which hasn't worked very well for him/us. Really hope they go down so we don't have to play them next season.

Yeah, Shinnie only did it once or twice max; Pitts was up there a few times, I commented to my son that while it was good to see him pushing on it meant we were short handed in midfield, and contrary to Orco’s opinion I thought Holt was largely anonymous in the first half until I mentioned that to my son & he suddenly burst in to life to make a good tackle and do some pressing. Then reverted to anonymity in the second half.

I have passionate hatred of diving cheats & for some reason St J are full of them & the refs fall for it every time. I also have passionate hatred of incompetent match officials who seem to think that if a Livi player is fouled but doesn’t go down screaming in unbearable agony then he must have fouled the opponent. Lost count of the times Nouble was fouled but had the decision either go the other way or not be given at all… I noticed it happened to Bailey at least once as well… a more cynical man than I may draw certain conclusions from that.

The other massive bug bear I had on Saturday was Ayo Obileye. There was a time earlier in the season where he looked the part but lately he has looked out of his depth & even his heading has been shockingly poor. Ivan & Fitz bailed him out big time on Saturday on a number of occasions.