Livi v Ayr

Admittedly Ayr upped their game in the second half but we definitely were worse. The thing is we came out in the second half with the wrong attitude; possibly thinking the game was already won. Okay; this happens; what concerned me was our failure to raise our game again and start to concentrate until almost 25 minutes into the second half.

Lithgow's in a very difficult position at the moment; he doesn't fully know more that half of the team no; actually from the starting eleven on Tuesday only Lamie; Pittman and Lawless were relatively regular last season. He's a relatively quiet guy and needs to get a lot more vocal so that people know he's around.

Hopefully we have a couple of quieter games for him to settle in more; although reports are that Stranraer have been over to top physically.

I agree. It was similar at the start of the second half at Falkirk. It was reminiscent of games under Burchill & Hoppy in his early days. We’d have a decent first half & then come out as if the half time refreshment options had been Ovaltine & Horlicks. (For the benefit of the young & innocent these are bed time drinks to help you sleep).

I always say it is a mistake to take your foot off the gas as you then struggle to get back up to speed.

On the captaincy, Devlin is definitely more vocal than Lithgow. And you’re right that he’s in a difficult position with so many new faces. He’s also having to follow one of the best captains we have had in the last 10-15 years who also was the best player at the club. But that era has gone & we move on, so Al has to impose his own style of captaincy.

Bertie Bassett wrote:When it comes to chances - going close, hitting the post, having a shot saved, missing a sitter or missing by a mile - they all have the same value, absolutely nothing. The only thing that counts is when it goes in the net.   So whether we could have, should have, would have been 2 or 3 up is irrelevant.
I saw enough in the first 15 minutes to give me cause for concern that Ayr would score at some point during the 90 mins. Yes we dominated the next 30 mins but we only scored once & admittedly were robbed of a second which would probably have sealed the deal but it didn’t count.

In the second half we were second best for at least half an hour and Ayr scored & had other chances but thankfully missed them without troubling Stewart. We grabbed the winner with our best bit of play in the second half.

And technically Stewart had 2 saves to make & only saved 1 of them.

Not really, it's relevant to saying whether it would be undeserved going in another goal up, which is what we're debating. The highlights show how much dominance we had, another goal wouldn't have flattered us at all, esp when we had a perfectly good goal chopped off, and could easily have got another to make it 3-0, so how could 2-0 flatter us?

Actually don't think it was the best play we had in the 2nd half, the one putting Dykes right through on goal was pretty slick, all he had to do was flick it past the keeper, but hit it low and hard straight at him, and there were a couple of other good moves in that half, so for all Ayr were the better team in the 2nd half with their passing the ball about, we had the better chances in both halves.

Liviforever wrote:

Bertie Bassett wrote:When it comes to chances - going close, hitting the post, having a shot saved, missing a sitter or missing by a mile - they all have the same value, absolutely nothing. The only thing that counts is when it goes in the net.   So whether we could have, should have, would have been 2 or 3 up is irrelevant.
I saw enough in the first 15 minutes to give me cause for concern that Ayr would score at some point during the 90 mins. Yes we dominated the next 30 mins but we only scored once & admittedly were robbed of a second which would probably have sealed the deal but it didn’t count.

In the second half we were second best for at least half an hour and Ayr scored & had other chances but thankfully missed them without troubling Stewart. We grabbed the winner with our best bit of play in the second half.

And technically Stewart had 2 saves to make & only saved 1 of them.

Not really, it's relevant to saying whether it would be undeserved going in another goal up, which is what we're debating. The highlights show how much dominance we had, another goal wouldn't have flattered us at all, esp when we had a perfectly good goal chopped off, and could easily have got another to make it 3-0, so how could 2-0 flatter us?

Actually don't think it was the best play we had in the 2nd half, the one putting Dykes right through on goal was pretty slick, all he had to do was flick it past the keeper, but hit it low and hard straight at him, and there were a couple of other good moves in that half, so for all Ayr were the better team in the 2nd half with their passing the ball about, we had the better chances in both halves.

Dont forget the one to Tiffoney - almost a mirror of the one at Motherwell yet he buried that one.

Tiffoney was 2nd half so not pertinent to 1st half discussion.

We went close a few time but a miss is as good as a mile, therefore irrelevant whether we missed by hitting the post & they missed by missing the target; both team had chances & we got closer than they did but we both missed. Yes we had a goal disallowed that looks a wrong decision to me but IMO, given the way Ayr had played - IMO they played very well, with some nice moves & at times looked a better passing team than us - then 2-0 would not have been a true reflection of both teams 1st half performances.

Second half they were a good bit better than us until the last 15 mins so I certainly wouldn’t have been surprised if it had ended 1-1; thankfully we showed a bit of quality in nicking the winner.

The move that put Dykes thru was good as was the save to deny him.

Moffat had an outstanding chance that he would normally have buried but he shanked it wide by some margin. He really ought to have scored and the move to set him up was good. Had he scored they would have been ahead. It was their best chance & they should have scored it... by your criteria, taking the second half in isolation, 2-1 to Ayr in that half wouldn’t have flattered them.

On yesterday’s performance the teams that finished above us will most likely finish above us again and the teams that finished below us will be a lot closer than last season.

Nevertheless... & perhaps we can agree on this... at least we are not St Johnstone fans  

Bertie Bassett wrote:Tiffoney was 2nd half so not pertinent to 1st half discussion.

Maybe not but never the less quite pertinent to the second half examples that Liviforever gave in his second paragraph.

Personally I think its too early to draw any conclusions from our performances thus far. If we'd done the same last season with Miller in charge we'd be certainties for the championship.

The Betfred mini leagues really does provide teams with an excellent opportunity to sort things out.

I agree, it is too early other than to say there is plenty room for improvement but there also signs that it will improve. The important thing is we won & gave ourselves an excellent chance to qualify for the knock out rounds.

Bertie Bassett wrote:I agree, it is too early other than to say there is plenty room for improvement but there also signs that it will improve. The important thing is we won & gave ourselves an excellent chance to qualify for the knock out rounds.

Agreed - funnily enough I've not been too bothered about the Betfred cup since it became the.... errrm.... Betfred cup but it does give sides a fighting chance to prepare; loads of potential banana skins (what on earth is happening with St Mirren although I bet Killie were wishing they were playing in the Betfred at the moment).

The other thing is the chance to stick one on Falkirk and Ayr can never be a bad thing.

Bertie Bassett wrote:I agree, it is too early other than to say there is plenty room for improvement but there also signs that it will improve. The important thing is we won & gave ourselves an excellent chance to qualify for the knock out rounds.

That's the only thing post match that we agree on in this thread Bertie.



Big Cece showed a good burst of pace which may be a saving grace for when he makes mistakes, he's a bit of a rough diamond though so hopefully he'll learn as he goes along and improve by the end of the season. The team still have to gel and get an understanding between them for these neat wee touches Ayr were putting together to come off for us too, and Souda certainly looks a good signing, so there are certainly lots of positives.


Looking at other results in the Betfred, there are quite a few Premiership team with a bit to work on before league action starts, hopefully we can do what we've done in the last 2 seasons and get off to a flier, and rack up a few points before the other teams start finding their feet.